Improving the feel of the rear brake

[afhaldeman]

9 minutes ago, kainic said:

What pads did you use?

 

https://camel-adv.com/products/galfer-brake-pads-yamaha-t7

[TimeMachine]

18 hours ago, ahamay said:

So, what is your verdict, timemachine, on your rear brake? Sorry, couldn't view the video. 

Yeah apologies for not spelling it out. I was expecting more conversation about it.

 

The video shows me borrowing the disk from the MT09 and fitting it to the T7. I already had EBC HH pads fitted to the T7 before I fit the rotor, and the pads alone did nothing really (apparently there ARE pad that will make a difference). The rotor made a huge difference, and when I ordered in a new rotor, replaced the brake fluid, cleaned the brake lever pivot point and got the adjustment right, the rear brake can only be described as exceptional. It is now very powerful and only requires light pressure to get good braking, and has good feel.

 

When adjusting the brake lever I found an interesting behaviour that might explain why some people are cooking their brakes. I lifted the bike onto a stand and got the adjustment very finely set so it required little lever movement before the pads touched the rotor. I did this when the bike was cold. I went out for a ride and everything felt fantastic. Later after the bike had been in the sun, I went to move the bike and the rear brake was grabbing without touching the lever. I gave the lever a pull and it moved slightly but still the brakes were grabbing. I had to readjust the brake lever to get it to free up.

 

The conclusion I came to was that the brakes should only be adjusted when they are warmed up, and the spring on the brake lever is too soft. I have been experimenting with a spring mounted to the lever to force it to return, which is working well, although it could use a slightly weaker spring, or set with less initial tension. It's still a work in progress.

 

[one wheel drive]

On 3/30/2021 at 2:21 AM, TimeMachine said:

This one.

 

Rear Brake Disc Rotor for Yamaha MT-07 MT-09 Tracer XSR 700 900 ABS 14 15 16 17

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Racing Hooks. Handlebars & Clip ons. Oil Filter. Bling Kits. Moto Guzzi. ATV Radiator. Fork Air Bleeder Valves. Handerbar Riser.

 

 

 

 

This thread is over a year old, but still of interest.

 

On first view, it looked like you went to a larger diameter disc and that's where the better braking came from. But that would  have required a new caliper mount, so apparently that wasn't it.

 

Other than the change in brake pads with a different compound . . . how would you explain better performance from a new rotor of the same diameter?

 

I'm not aware there is a different grippyness from one make of rotor to another. What am I missing?

 

 

:

 

 

.

[TimeMachine]

1 hour ago, one wheel drive said:

Other than the change in brake pads with a different compound . . . how would you explain better performance from a new rotor of the same diameter?

 

I'm not aware there is a different grippyness from one make of rotor to another. What am I missing?

There is a significant different in grippyness (is that a word?) from one rotor to another. Or perhaps more accurately one combination of rotor and pad from another. This combination of HH pads with a cheap (~$60 USD) rotor works almost too well and is the cheapest fix available. In fact this change of rotor is cheaper than replacing the pads for the organic Yamaha XT660 pads, which was another suggestion that seems popular. And changing brake lines or caliper or master cylinder would each cost hundreds of dollars, so why wouldn't anyone try this first?

 

Interestingly I am not aware of anyone that has done it other than me. There is a saying something about leading a horse to water. But sooner or later people will figure it out.

[kainic]

So has anyone else try this out?  Seems a simple way to improve the rear.  Nice winter project in my future.

[DT675]

Im going to have to give this a try soon. I just finished up flushing my rear brakes to hopefully find a little more feel and NOPE.  Same. I’m pretty sure I could push that damn pedal all the way to the floor. 

[S.Ga.Rider]

I upgraded my pads to the galfer ones listed but got them from ebay. My rear brake went from no feel and no power to how it should be. The rear will easily slide on the dirt now and is how it should be from the factory. It was a big upgrade for $25.

[DT675]

6 hours ago, S.Ga.Rider said:

I upgraded my pads to the galfer ones listed but got them from ebay. My rear brake went from no feel and no power to how it should be. The rear will easily slide on the dirt now and is how it should be from the factory. It was a big upgrade for $25.

Got a link for those pads?

[afhaldeman]

See my reply above

[S.Ga.Rider]

7 hours ago, DT675 said:

Got a link for those pads?

Fd165g1054 is the part number. 

[DT675]

Yep, I should’ve seen that, thanks! 

[Spike4379]

On 9/29/2021 at 12:03 PM, TimeMachine said:

There is a significant different in grippyness (is that a word?) from one rotor to another. Or perhaps more accurately one combination of rotor and pad from another. This combination of HH pads with a cheap (~$60 USD) rotor works almost too well and is the cheapest fix available. In fact this change of rotor is cheaper than replacing the pads for the organic Yamaha XT660 pads, which was another suggestion that seems popular. And changing brake lines or caliper or master cylinder would each cost hundreds of dollars, so why wouldn't anyone try this first?

 

Interestingly I am not aware of anyone that has done it other than me. There is a saying something about leading a horse to water. But sooner or later people will figure it out.

 

I just ordered that rotor. AND ITS IN AUSTRALIA TOOO!!! Should be here next week for me.

My rear pad wore out so fast it toasted the rotor too, it was literally fine last week and today i could feel it, nope. Too F^*@#%^! late. Got a new set of pads to replace the stock ones front and rear, gonna deglaze the front too

[TimeMachine]

10 minutes ago, Spike4379 said:

 

I just ordered that rotor. AND ITS IN AUSTRALIA TOOO!!! Should be here next week for me.

My rear pad wore out so fast it toasted the rotor too, it was literally fine last week and today i could feel it, nope. Too F^*@#%^! late. Got a new set of pads to replace the stock ones front and rear, gonna deglaze the front too

Would be good if you can share you experience with this team when you have had a chance to bed in the new brakes. Also worth reading through some of the other small fixes in this thread to avoid the brakes roasting again. My little spring fix for example has been doing a fine job of keeping the rear brake off when it is meant to be off.

[Spike4379]

3 hours ago, TimeMachine said:

Would be good if you can share you experience with this team when you have had a chance to bed in the new brakes. Also worth reading through some of the other small fixes in this thread to avoid the brakes roasting again. My little spring fix for example has been doing a fine job of keeping the rear brake off when it is meant to be off.

Yeah I'm gonna need to have a good look, the rear pushing itself on even when it has the lubed pivot bolts to slide on is so stupid. theres no way it should be pushing itself on somehow. I kind of prefer a fixed rear calliper placement like all my other bikes had, this is the first one to do this and the first one with this mounting system, i dont believe in coincidences

 

[williestreet]

7 hours ago, TimeMachine said:

Would be good if you can share you experience with this team when you have had a chance to bed in the new brakes. Also worth reading through some of the other small fixes in this thread to avoid the brakes roasting again. My little spring fix for example has been doing a fine job of keeping the rear brake off when it is meant to be off.

I did something similar.  

Small plate/bracket on the case and a shorter spring to do the same job.  If the snow ever goes away I will have a chance to test it fully.

Black hose over the spring makes it almost disappear.  Sorry for some reason all my pics seem to show up sideways or upside down.

 

[AZJW]

On 3/3/2022 at 10:12 PM, DT675 said:

Got a link for those pads?

Cory @Camel ADV carries them also.

 

GALFER Brake Pads Yamaha 700 Tenere

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We upgraded the brake pads own our 700 Tenere to GALFER units, huge improvement! For the front of the bike we opted for HH Sintered compound: Better initial bite than the OEM front pads Advanced ceramic...

 

[Spike4379]

Okay update from me. Got the exact rotor from that ebay seller and I swear its like 2mm thicker which is fine, it fits a new set of pads.

Very easy install thanks to your video too!

 

Down to business.

High speed braking +new sintered pads: 9.5/10

Low speed braking: 9/10

Basically as good as you can get these bikes to stop via rear without changing calliper.

 

Simple to install even for my first time taking the rear off myself.

Would I buy one of these rotors over the stock yamaha tenere one? Every single time, no contest at all.

After about 5 km it felt the same as after a good 30 km ride.

 

Cheaper, possibly thicker, construction looks good as OEM.

Just do it.

[Yasenia]

On 4/4/2022 at 4:59 AM, williestreet said:

I did something similar.  

Small plate/bracket on the case and a shorter spring to do the same job.  If the snow ever goes away I will have a chance to test it fully.

Black hose over the spring makes it almost disappear.  Sorry for some reason all my pics seem to show up sideways or upside down.

 

Someone else was having the same problem with pictures, try changing to name of the file for each picture. Or opening the picture and saving it using "Save As." That should work, but if it fails save it in a different format.  That fixed it for him. 

[Yasenia]

Did anyone else noticed the footnote in the Camel website?  I really don't believe that they are joking. So some people actually thought that they could get brake pads for a few bucks and a bike would come with it, really? 

 

*MOTORCYCLE NOT INCLUDED* (Yup, apparently this footnote is required, we've had questions)

 

[AngryNeutron]

17 minutes ago, Yasenia said:

Did anyone else noticed the footnote in the Camel website?  I really don't believe that they are joking. So some people actually thought that they could get brake pads for a few bucks and a bike would come with it, really? 

 

*MOTORCYCLE NOT INCLUDED* (Yup, apparently this footnote is required, we've had questions)

 

 

The unfortunate byproduct of an overly litigious society....

[Ray Ride4life]

1 hour ago, AngryNeutron said:

 

The unfortunate byproduct of an overly litigious society....

No, the result of wanting to safe every life with rules and safety regulations keeping the dumb alive and sadly the dumb are also the most reproductive expanding the gene pool that should extinct naturally.
It's not a popular opinion but i grew up without rubber tiles, anti bacterial soap and got laughed at when i hurt myself being stupid.

[AngryNeutron]

17 minutes ago, Ray Ride4life said:

No, the result of wanting to safe every life with rules and safety regulations keeping the dumb alive and sadly the dumb are also the most reproductive expanding the gene pool that should extinct naturally.
It's not a popular opinion but i grew up without rubber tiles, anti bacterial soap and got laughed at when i hurt myself being stupid.

While I agree that many safety regulations today are targeted at those with the least common sense, I don't think "Motorcycle not included" is a safety issue.  It keeps greedy and opportunistic people from taking companies to court when they don't get their free bike with their $30 brake pad purchase.

[Yasenia]

5 hours ago, Ray Ride4life said:

No, the result of wanting to safe every life with rules and safety regulations keeping the dumb alive and sadly the dumb are also the most reproductive expanding the gene pool that should extinct naturally.
It's not a popular opinion but i grew up without rubber tiles, anti bacterial soap and got laughed at when i hurt myself being stupid.

Same here, I grew up playing on the streets with other kids. Being a that I was a huge tomboy I played with boys and have the scars on my knees and legs and elbows to prove it. We jumped, ran, rode skateboard and  bicycles, climbed trees, played sports (including tackle football with no gear), and on and on and here I am.
 

My parents worst fear was me hanging around a lot of boys for obvious reasons. Not about me developing type II diabetes in my teens like some parents do nowadays. Hell, their fears came true when I was gang raped, but hell, that made me stronger and it has never held me back from anything. We were "built" differently back them and our mentality was different. You felt down and picked yourself up from the ground, got on your bike again and tried again. We took responsibility for our crap. Now days they blame everything on everyone else but themselves. From government to teachers to parents. Like the idiots who buy a house near the airport and them bitch and moan bout the noise. Seriously genius, you didn't think about that before you bought the house?
 

This is true, I was listening to Dr. Dryer talk about mental health. He said that in the past decade suicide among children 8-12 (that is right, eight years of age to twelve years of age) has gone up 400%. And underage kids receiving therapy for emotional and mental problems has gone up 700%. That is crazy! In the US alone just short of 77 million people are on drugs. Just over 31 million for anxiety and almost 22 million for "mood stabilizers." We have more therapists psychologists, and psychiatrists in the US today than in the entire world, yet we are falling apart. May be most need a good O' fashion spank in the rear to snap them back to reality. Oh wait, you can't do that anymore. 

[Yasenia]

5 hours ago, AngryNeutron said:

While I agree that many safety regulations today are targeted at those with the least common sense, I don't think "Motorcycle not included" is a safety issue.  It keeps greedy and opportunistic people from taking companies to court when they don't get their free bike with their $30 brake pad purchase.

Talking about courts, it's so bad that way back in the day when I was studying aviation, our instructor told us of a guy, someone with money cause he had his own single engine plane. He showed up at the Van Nuys Airport drunk out of his mimd, got on his plane, took off, and flew right into the mountains up above Sylmar. Of course he died in the crash. His wife sued the manufacture of the plane and got a huge chunk of money.

 

In just about a decade planes that used to cost 25-40k  new went up to a couple hundred of thousands of dollars. The same plane now new sells from 300,00-500,00 depending on avionics. A huge part of the cost is due to the liability insurance manufactures of planes and anyone who makes any part of the plane must get to cover their asses.

 

If greedy attorneys did to motorcycling what they did to aviation, my T7 that I paid about 12.5k with taxes and all the other charges included, would had cost me somewhere between 25-40 thousand, may be more.

 

But hey remember people, now days everything is someone else's fault, never yours. You are not the one who lacks common sense, someone else does. And assumptions are as good as facts.

[Ray Ride4life]

19 minutes ago, Yasenia said:

You felt down and picked yourself up from the ground, got on your bike again and tried again

Still the same.
2 weeks ago i did an advanced offroad course (did the Basis with my VFR1200X and the intermediate with the XT660Z i recently sold) and one thing the instructor liked about me was that when it went wrong i just got back up and do it again, and again.
This weekend (it's a long weekend) i planned to get the blog about it online on my website.