T7 Fork Open Cartridge Kit

[Ktmmitch]

10 hours ago, Toei said:

Ktmmitch:  What is the feasibility of implementing internal lowering of the forks when installing this kit?

None, it would mean sliding the forks through the triples

[Toei]

44 minutes ago, Ktmmitch said:

None, it would mean sliding the forks through the triples

Ok, glad I asked!  Tractive offers a -35mm closed cartridge kit, and corresponding -35mm shocks, but I'd prefer open cartridges for the easier servicing.  I'm going to wait to see if any additional options develop over the winter before springing for their closed cartridge kit.  

[Matth]

I had already written my thoughts on another page but i know it may have been hidden away so will stick it on this one .

So after a long a chilly ride to Rally Raid my new front suspension was waiting for me.

when the old internals were pulled out and the new Open cartridge set was side by side you can see it is significantly differently and understand why the original units is not ideal for my style of riding.

the standard suspension is ideally for generic riding , little bit of this and that but far too easy to reach its limits.

so a bit about me, 50 and ex enduro rider of 30 years.

still off road ride and need a better more compliant ride now.

 

we all know what the existing springy bits like on the front.

not reactive

can be harsh if ridden fast off road

bottoms out to easily

brake dive and wallows.

ridden really fast on rough gravel and tank slap will appear.

 

Rally Raid took 2 hours to install the new kit and set my weight up ( 90kgs clothed)

 

i went for a quick trip after it was set up and the first thing i noticed it dives ALOT less.

 

I then found a rough gravel track and pushed it, gone is the harsh reaction and where as before i would avoid a pothole ( gravel) just go straight through. Instead of a bang you get a phumf:)) .

the faster you go the smoother it becomes and sort of starts to float .

 I have a Rally Raid upgraded spring on the rear and because the front is well sorted you start to notice the rear being lesser grade. I adjusted that more and it became absolutely fine and good enough.

 

I found a grass verge which was 12 inchies high approx vertical, i just hit it square on. OH Yes what a massive difference, nice and soft up it went. No bottoming and nasty noises, quietly took it in its stride. 

And back down it exactly the same with no question whether you will damage something.

 

On the road  it was slightly firmer than the yam set up so i wound the pre load off ( left hand fork) and was very much better. The 5mm spacer was installed so if you want a softer highly damped feel you can do it.

kit comes with the tools to do it.

 

Needs bedding in but after 200 miles was more compliant on the road and more sports bike handling, less wallowing.

 

Overall I'm so pleased with it and WELL worth doing  as can ride to my full potential without grimacing when i hit some rough ground.

 

[Matth]

Hi Engineer.

 

ive had the open kit installed as mentioned and went for the Light springs 5.6 Nm which are longer springs than the 6nm units and now it’s exactly as it should be. Very close to plush on broken tarmac where inherently it was not.

now the front feels a little like my GS on the normal/slow riding and the faster trails just soaks it up.

 

Really really pleased with the end results from Rally Raid and look great to.

 

Thanks John for helping me to get the results!

Edited October 28, 2020 by Matth

[powder]

5.6Nm springs are even softer than the ultra soft stock ones, that is weird.

 

On 10/28/2020 at 8:02 AM, Matth said:

Hi Engineer.

 

ive had the open kit installed as mentioned and went for the Light springs 5.6 Nm which are longer springs than the 6nm units and now it’s exactly as it should be. Very close to plush on broken tarmac where inherently it was not.

now the front feels a little like my GS on the normal/slow riding and the faster trails just soaks it up.

 

Really really pleased with the end results from Rally Raid and look great to.

 

Thanks John for helping me to get the results!

 

[Engineer]

Hi @Matth, I've also gone for the 5.6 fork springs currently with 5mm spacer and no extra pre-load. The race sag is about right at that. Not had much chance to ride recently, but I've found the original recommended damper settings (6 clicks out on compression and 4 out on rebound) perhaps a bit stiff for me, so i'm in the process of trying some softer settings. I would be interested to hear what settings you are using.

[Matth]

Not sure what the standard spring rate is, I wouldn't say it was softer however alot more controlled and with the softer springs installed you have loads of pre load to play with so can set up exactly how you want it.

after 1200 miles now its bedded in nicely and much better than the standard set up. 

Hi engineer, i wanted plush on road and controlled off so went with 10 /12 clicks out .

i rode the same track that i did with the original system in and is very different now. Easily 60 mph and controlled where as before 40/50 and pretty uncontrollable and a tank slap appeared. Bit scary:))

Edited November 12, 2020 by Matth

[powder]

@Ktmmitch I've seen how the spring rates on your cartridges have been going lower over time; are the 5.6Nm springs something normal now instead of the 6.0?

[Ktmmitch]

1 hour ago, powder said:

@Ktmmitch I've seen how the spring rates on your cartridges have been going lower over time; are the 5.6Nm springs something normal now instead of the 6.0?

Correct, we did start off with 6,4 and 6,0 as the softer option, but due to customer feedback we have dropped by one grade to offer softer spring rates. Due to the larger 35mm piston, that are 300% larger in swept area than the oem 20mm pistons, the controlled damping takes a lot of pressure off the springs, so this is why we have lowered the rates.

we always welcome customer feedback, and are continually developing and improving our products.

[Rich TT]

15 minutes ago, Ktmmitch said:

Correct, we did start off with 6,4 and 6,0 as the softer option, but due to customer feedback we have dropped by one grade to offer softer spring rates. Due to the larger 35mm piston, that are 300% larger in swept area than the oem 20mm pistons, the controlled damping takes a lot of pressure off the springs, so this is why we have lowered the rates.

we always welcome customer feedback, and are continually developing and improving our products.

Is that what I've got then John @Ktmmitch? Open cartridge just arrived and spoke to you today about the preload. I ordered the 6Nm for my weight (85kg naked), so guessing I got the 5.6Nm (which is fine). Just checking for information.

 

Cheers

Rich

Edited November 13, 2020 by Rich TT

[Matth]

Rich i would imagine you got the 6nm for your weight. Im 87 kg fully dressed with helmet and i wanted a softer generic ride On the top of spring it will tell you which one you have  but 6nm sounds spot on.

[Rich TT]

4 minutes ago, Matth said:

Rich i would imagine you got the 6nm for your weight. Im 87 kg fully dressed with helmet and i wanted a softer generic ride On the top of spring it will tell you which one you have  but 6nm sounds spot on.

Thanks! I did unpack to check what it looks like but didn't unpack the springs. It's like Christmas has come early

[Rich TT]

6Nm it is @Matth !!

 

Looking forward to trying these off and on road.

 

Thanks

Rich

[Ktmmitch]

Some suspension testing of our Yamaha T7 fork & shock kits in sunny Australia, with our friend David Darcy of MAD-TV he gets a bit breathless in the last 5 minutes of the video !!,

 

 

 

Edited November 18, 2020 by Ktmmitch

[Canzvt]

How is your product different to this - 

Benvenuti nel sito ufficiale di Andreani Group International

---

Specialisti sospensioni auto, moto e mtb. Distributori dei marchi Öhlins, Mivv, Samco, Regina, PFC, White Line, Hagon, Earl’s, DWS, TNK

Your landed pricing is quite a bit more than the Andreani solution. They also offer a short version (not for me though).

[Osprio]

Here’s a copy of my post on a similar topic. I hope someone finds it useful 

 

I was just about to start a new topic with regards to on-road behavior rather than the many topics we see here which focus on off-road behavior. I have done 7k miles over the last 4 months, around 95% on A, B and Motorway roads. The bike is really good and very steady in all conditions in it's factory set up but with a bit of adjustment it is simply great.

The front in it's original state did feel a bit light and not as planted as i would have liked for higher speed cornering and the back a bit on the soft side leaving you with a wollowing feeling when you are on the throttle exiting a corner.

I spend 4 hours yesterday with a suspension set up specialist and £90 later, after a number of measurements, tweeks and track trials, i am gobsmacked with the difference it has made, without any need for buying aftermarket hardware (a note on this at the end of this reply).

 

This is a detailed list of the final settings for my weight:

T7 Suspension settings for road use

 

Fully clothed / 95 kilo

 

Turn everything all the way anti-clockwise

 

Forks

 

raise both forks up 4mm (lowers front by 4mm)

 

Compression (bottom of forks)

 

11 clicks clockwise 

 

Rebound (Top of forks)

 

11 clicks clockwise 

 

Rear Shock

 

Preload 

 

Full / all the way  clockwise 

 

Static sag 20mm (perfect)

 

Sag 58-62 mm  (perfect)

 

Compression (top of spring)

 

18 clicks clockwise 

 

Rebound (bottom of spring)

 

14 clicks clockwise 

 

Tyres 

 

Front

 

Continental KTC 70

 

90/90 21 M/C 54H TL M+S

 

Pressure 30 PSI

 

Rear

 

Continental KTC 70

 

150/70 R18 M/C 70H TL M+S

 

Pressure 34 PSI

 

Note: the preload is no doubt on the limit for my weight and for touring there is a need to change to an 80nm rear shock. Costs around £80-90 and £50 for fitting.

[Ktmmitch]

3 hours ago, Canzvt said:

How is your product different to this - 

Benvenuti nel sito ufficiale di Andreani Group International

---

Specialisti sospensioni auto, moto e mtb. Distributori dei marchi Öhlins, Mivv, Samco, Regina, PFC, White Line, Hagon, Earl’s, DWS, TNK

Your landed pricing is quite a bit more than the Andreani solution. They also offer a short version (not for me though).

Much larger piston, more progressive and improved PDS

[Ktmmitch]

1 hour ago, Osprio said:

Here’s a copy of my post on a similar topic. I hope someone finds it useful 

 

 

I was just about to start a new topic with regards to on-road behavior rather than the many topics we see here which focus on off-road behavior. I have done 7k miles over the last 4 months, around 95% on A, B and Motorway roads. The bike is really good and very steady in all conditions in it's factory set up but with a bit of adjustment it is simply great.

The front in it's original state did feel a bit light and not as planted as i would have liked for higher speed cornering and the back a bit on the soft side leaving you with a wollowing feeling when you are on the throttle exiting a corner.

I spend 4 hours yesterday with a suspension set up specialist and £90 later, after a number of measurements, tweeks and track trials, i am gobsmacked with the difference it has made, without any need for buying aftermarket hardware (a note on this at the end of this reply).

 

This is a detailed list of the final settings for my weight:

T7 Suspension settings for road use

 

Fully clothed / 95 kilo

 

Turn everything all the way anti-clockwise

 

Forks

 

raise both forks up 4mm (lowers front by 4mm)

 

Compression (bottom of forks)

 

11 clicks clockwise 

 

Rebound (Top of forks)

 

11 clicks clockwise 

 

Rear Shock

 

Preload 

 

Full / all the way  clockwise 

 

Static sag 20mm (perfect)

 

Sag 58-62 mm  (perfect)

 

Compression (top of spring)

 

18 clicks clockwise 

 

Rebound (bottom of spring)

 

14 clicks clockwise 

 

Tyres 

 

Front

 

Continental KTC 70

 

90/90 21 M/C 54H TL M+S

 

Pressure 30 PSI

 

Rear

 

Continental KTC 70

 

150/70 R18 M/C 70H TL M+S

 

Pressure 34 PSI

 

Note: the preload is no doubt on the limit for my weight and for touring there is a need to change to an 80nm rear shock. Costs around £80-90 and £50 for fitting.

This is a thread in our Vendors thread discussing our Open Cartridge fork kit, if you want to discuss your modifications to the oem forks then I suggest you start a dedicated thread in general suspension, where others can comment freely

[Osprio]

Apologies, will do. However, I didn’t see any objections to previous quote of Adrian’s setup on the OEM. 

Edited November 18, 2020 by Osprio

[MikeCMP]

I bought a kit from someone who ordered it before he got is T7, then ended up not getting a T7.  almost the perfect setup for me , open cartridge and the extreme shock. Shock went on last night will get some miles on it tomorrow, cartridges going in on saturday. 

 

I weigh about 97kg without my gear, I was going to put the 6.4 Nmm front springs in with a single preload washer. the guy who ordered it also had 6.8nm springs which I think are a little much for my weight but would love to hear opinions on that. 

Edited November 19, 2020 by MikeCMP

[powder]

If the fork was stock, the 6,8Nm springs would be good for your weight but since people have started buying the Tractive/Rally Raid, they have been complaining about being too hard and thus they are slowly lowering their recommended spring rates quite a bit. 

 

Let's see what John says. 

[MikeCMP]

I ended up putting in the 6.4n/mm springs. No preload spacer. After I was done we quickly checked sag and it was almost perfect. I know I need to check after it breaks in but it was almost exactly 60 mm, just a little over with me on it. When I add luggage and that I think the fork cap preload should handle it.

 

As fat as how well it works, I have ridden a few hundred miles on the shock, and it’s amazing. I thought I was sore bc my seat was uncomfortable but apparently the harshness of the stock under sprung suspension was doing a number on me. The Rr shock sticks the tire to the road better on washboard and is just awesome.

 

i only have a short test ride on the forks, but they were noticeably better. Had my friend help get the cartridges in, he rode ipthe bike beforehand and thought it was nice.  Afterward he roadie it again and stated how much np enter they felt, it was easy to tell bc all the smaller bumps just were absorbed, instead of pounding through the handlebars.  Also there is a little bump at the end of my driveway that’s a good test, the new forks absorbed it no problem.

 

very happy so far, especially since I got a new unused kit for about half off.

 

i guess I will list the 6.8n/mm springs for sale, someone might need a pair off them. 
 

Mike

[Alf Meister]

23 minutes ago, MikeCMP said:

I ended up putting in the 6.4n/mm springs. No preload spacer. After I was done we quickly checked sag and it was almost................

 

very happy so far, especially since I got a new unused kit for about half off.

 

i guess I will list the 6.8n/mm springs for sale, someone might need a pair off them. 
 

Mike

How did you manage that, 50% off ? I tried to get a small discount with no interest what so ever, so I didn't bother. 

[MikeCMP]

Easy, a guy on advrider ordered the kit before he got his bike. He changed his mind on the bike and offered up the kit for sale bc he didn’t want to send it back ,so I got a pretty good discount that way buying it se one hand.

 

its the kit I was going to buy anyway and worth it at full price. I just happened to get really lucky. 
 

Mike

[Rich TT]

Just been for a quick run out after my Rally Raid open cartridge fork inserts have been fitted by my local Yamaha dealer.

 

I cannot believe the change. It feels like a different bike altogether, and in a very positive way. So much less dive under the bikes own weight initially and far less dive and that mushy feel when on the brakes.

 

It feels like a taught Supermoto actually but the suspension still moves and works. The harshness of the standard forks has also gone. I left the rebound and compression as standard from the RR instructions but set the rider and static sag properly. 

 

Can't wait to sling the off road tyres on and try it out in anger and have a play with the settings. But for me, it's already loads better on the road and that's in the winter being gentleish.

 

Absolutely quality workmanship and also lots lighter than the standard internals by my feel in my hands.

 

Cheers John aka @Ktmmitchand team!!

 

Well worth the money.

 

Remap booked in Friday at Dave Wood Racing and we're all done... for now

 

Rich

Edited December 9, 2020 by Rich TT