Tenere 700 Sag

[PJS]

On ‎2‎/‎18‎/‎2020 at 6:44 AM, Janka said:

Huge thanks for information!! That was helpfull!

Please report back on 80n/mm spring - what clicks to get correct sag settings!

 

I have big offroad trip planned with all my camping gear etc., so i'm interested on 85N/mm spring! But will i be abble to get correct sag settings without any luggage at all?

 

Will report back next week when spring is installed.

[Rich TT]

I posted on this in another section.

 

The standard spring is rated at 70Nm which is suitable for a 65 to 70kg person . I have gone for a 90Nm from the advice of Rally raid products (see their website for the explanation).

 

 Yamaha T7 Uprated OEM Shock Spring-RRP 627

---

Yamaha T7 Uprated OEM Shock Spring

 

I weigh 14 stone or 89kg (in my pants)! 

 

With the original spring I had to wind in 22 clicks of preload (out of 24) to get the rider sag anywhere near right.

 

Adding more preload raises the height of the bike on its suspension under it's own weight.

 

I now only have to have 4-5 clicks to get the right rider sag with the new 90Nm spring. An added bonus is the bike sits lower when I'm on it with my feet on the ground (note with me feet taking the weight). So easier to move around when "paddling".

 

Cheers

Rich

[Whitey66]

Hi Rich, I asked the question in another thread but not sure if you saw it? What were your static sag heights with each spring?

Mine is only 15mm with standard spring at maximum preload which indicates too weak a spring for my weight. I'm interested what your static sag is with new 90Nm spring after setting your race sag correctly.

Edited February 19, 2020 by Whitey66

[Rich TT]

1 hour ago, Whitey66 said:

Hi Rich, I asked the question in another thread but not sure if you saw it? What were your static sag heights with each spring?

Mine is only 15mm with standard spring at maximum preload which indicates too weak a spring for my weight. I'm interested what your static sag is with new 90Nm spring after setting your race sag correctly.

I've got them all written down at home (old vs. new spring) both rider and static sag. I'll reply when I can.

 

I know that I couldn't still get the rider sag at the ideal 60mm (30% of 200mm) even with 22 clicks of preload added or then the static sag. I'm now spot on with both with only 4-5 clicks on the 90Nm spring. When I wound up to 22 clicks with the new spring there was hardly any static sag at all as you'd expect, but I've now got the option to increase preload with a passenger and/or luggage which I didn't before.

 

Cheers

Rich

[Rich TT]

Standard spring. 22 clicks preload to get rider sag anywhere near right. Rider sag 64mm (32%) and static sag 26mm (13%).

 

New 90Nm spring. 5 clicks preload only. Rider sag 60mm (exactly 30% of 200mm) and static sag 19mm (10% of 200mm).

 

I'm 90kg and race sag set with all gear on.

 

Cheers

Rich

[Ktmmitch]

On 2/18/2020 at 5:44 AM, Janka said:

Huge thanks for information!! That was helpfull!

Please report back on 80n/mm spring - what clicks to get correct sag settings!

 

I have big offroad trip planned with all my camping gear etc., so i'm interested on 85N/mm spring! But will i be abble to get correct sag settings without any luggage at all?

The 10mm stroke of the piston on the Hydraulic preload Adjuster can compensate for around 65 kgs  of extra weight and still achieve the 60mm optimum rider sag, as long as the rider only 60mm setting is done with the HPA on or nears it's minimum stroke.

On 2/18/2020 at 5:44 AM, Janka said:

 

 

[Sandijs]

14 hours ago, Ktmmitch said:

The 10mm stroke of the piston on the Hydraulic preload Adjuster can compensate for around 65 kgs  of extra weight and still achieve the 60mm optimum rider sag, as long as the rider only 60mm setting is done with the HPA on or nears it's minimum stroke.

 

Mitch, thanks for the answer, but can you write it in english?    

[Ktmmitch]

2 hours ago, Janka said:

Mitch, thanks for the answer, but can you write it in english?    

What I mean is, if you get the correct sag (for solo rider) set at 60mm, and the HPA is virtually on it's minimum stroke, then you have around 10mm of extra preload you can use on the HPA (by turning the knob/handle) which equates to about 65kgs of extra load capacity, and still maintaining the ideal 60mm sag.

Is that explanation better? It's not an easy one to explain.

[Sandijs]

4 minutes ago, Ktmmitch said:

What I mean is, if you get the correct sag (for solo rider) set at 60mm, and the HPA is virtually on it's minimum stroke, then you have around 10mm of extra preload you can use on the HPA (by turning the knob/handle) which equates to about 65kgs of extra load capacity, and still maintaining the ideal 60mm sag.

Is that explanation better? It's not an easy one to explain.

Thanks! I think i got it!

 

One more question -  if i remmember correctly, you where considering to use the progressive springs (at least in the forks), but than you decided for linear springs front and rear. So why not progressive springs? What are the minuses for progressive springs?

Edited February 21, 2020 by Janka

[Ktmmitch]

We tried progressive, but it did'nt work with the fork, so we used slightly softer linear, but with new internals, and now achieve full stroke and good action.

We never use progressive springs on the rear with a linkage, the linkage, by nature, is progressive as it is Rising Rate design.

[PJS]

On ‎2‎/‎18‎/‎2020 at 6:44 AM, Janka said:

Huge thanks for information!! That was helpfull!

Please report back on 80n/mm spring - what clicks to get correct sag settings!

 

I have big offroad trip planned with all my camping gear etc., so i'm interested on 85N/mm spring! But will i be abble to get correct sag settings without any luggage at all?

 

80N/mm spring from Rally Raid:

10-11clicks preload:

Static sag 25mm
Race sag: 60mm

Race sag measured with gear 85kg.

 

 

 

Edited February 27, 2020 by PJS

[Sandijs]

7 hours ago, PJS said:

80N/mm spring from Rally Raid:

10clicks preload:

Static sag 25mm
Race sag: 60mm

Race sag measured with gear 85kg.

 

 

 

Thanks for information, @PJS

[Colddog]

If for example a 90nm spring was put into the rear, would the front forks need to be re-sprung too?

Have you guys that are actually riding your bikes found the front end to be having too much sag?

I was wondering if having an adjustable fork preload would be the icing on the cake for econo upgrades.

Edited February 27, 2020 by Colddog

[Rich TT]

38 minutes ago, Colddog said:

If for example a 90nm spring was put into the rear, would the front forks need to be re-sprung too?

Have you guys that are actually riding your bikes found the front end to be having too much sag?

I was wondering if having an adjustable fork preload would be the icing on the cake for econo upgrades.

No need at the moment for me I would say. It's only the rear that's too softly sprung.

 

Mine now feels ace all round on the road (not been back off road since I changed it as yet)

[Colddog]

Good to know, you are about the same size as me so that is reassuring, thanks!

[NABUURS]

I'm a mechanic at a Yamaha dealer and motocrosser, I did a testride on the T700 thrue bumps etc. and my conclusion was the forks have to be adjusted stiffer both comp. and reb. and a little bit of extra oil. The rearshock has to be taken apart to change the

setting of the shimstack it has not enough resistant on bigger bumps and is to stiff on little bumps.

I will take one apart in the coming weeks and see what is in it. 

[djkouross]

Keeping OEM spring:

- 78kg + gear (no luggage)

- Preload: 12 clicks (out of 24)

- Sag (dynamic): 65mm (32.5%)

 

Hope it helps!

[Ktmmitch]

11 hours ago, NABUURS said:

I'm a mechanic at a Yamaha dealer and motocrosser, I did a testride on the T700 thrue bumps etc. and my conclusion was the forks have to be adjusted stiffer both comp. and reb. and a little bit of extra oil. The rearshock has to be taken apart to change the

setting of the shimstack it has not enough resistant on bigger bumps and is to stiff on little bumps.

I will take one apart in the coming weeks and see what is in it. 

Are you going to set the static and rider sag before you adjust damping?

[NABUURS]

I already did, but in my opinion the shock needs a revalve.

[Ktmmitch]

A VIDEO FROM OUR FRIENDS MAD-TV, IN AUSTRALIA, EXPLAINING THE SUSPENSION SET-UP ON THE YAMAHA T7

 

 

[Aleksandar13]

10 hours ago, Ktmmitch said:

A VIDEO FROM OUR FRIENDS MAD-TV, IN AUSTRALIA, EXPLAINING THE SUSPENSION SET-UP ON THE YAMAHA T7

 

 

Great stuff thank you for posting... Watched the video and the blurr that I used to have in regards to suspension is getting better.. 

 

 

[djkouross]

On 2/19/2020 at 10:20 AM, Rich TT said:

I posted on this in another section.

 

The standard spring is rated at 70Nm which is suitable for a 65 to 70kg person . I have gone for a 90Nm from the advice of Rally raid products (see their website for the explanation).

 

 Yamaha T7 Uprated OEM Shock Spring-RRP 627

---

Yamaha T7 Uprated OEM Shock Spring

 

I weigh 14 stone or 89kg (in my pants)! 

 

With the original spring I had to wind in 22 clicks of preload (out of 24) to get the rider sag anywhere near right.

 

Adding more preload raises the height of the bike on its suspension under it's own weight.

 

I now only have to have 4-5 clicks to get the right rider sag with the new 90Nm spring. An added bonus is the bike sits lower when I'm on it with my feet on the ground (note with me feet taking the weight). So easier to move around when "paddling".

 

Cheers

Rich

From an ignorance/learner perspective, this statement shouldn't be correct as far as I understand. My reasoning being that if you had the proper SAG with OEM spring and with 90NM spring (difference made by preload adjustments) the bike should stand at the same height in both cases as in both cases its using 30% of travel, ie 200mm from full extension.

 

Am I right? 

 

 

 

[Rich TT]

19 minutes ago, djkouross said:

From an ignorance/learner perspective, this statement shouldn't be correct as far as I understand. My reasoning being that if you had the proper SAG with OEM spring and with 90NM spring (difference made by preload adjustments) the bike should stand at the same height in both cases as in both cases its using 30% of travel, ie 200mm from full extension.

 

Am I right? 

 

 

 

Not quite. The key is the setting the race sag and the static sag is the result of the race sag. Winding more preload raises the bike on its suspension. Now I have to wind less preload, so the bike sits slightly lower on its own that it did before. Note I couldn't really get the right race sag before even dialing in 22 out of 24 clicks. I couldn't get the right rider or static sag before but now I can. 60mm and 20mm respectively.

 

Rich

[Whitey66]

29 minutes ago, djkouross said:

From an ignorance/learner perspective, this statement shouldn't be correct as far as I understand. My reasoning being that if you had the proper SAG with OEM spring and with 90NM spring (difference made by preload adjustments) the bike should stand at the same height in both cases as in both cases its using 30% of travel, ie 200mm from full extension.

 

Am I right? 

 

 

 

No, the race sag may be the same but the static sag may be different.

[djkouross]

Apologies, I mean race sag. With both setups (OEM and 90NM, each with corresponding preload) with the same RACE sag (30%/200mm) the rider height in the bike should be the same, hence feet should touch the floor equally in both cases. Right?

 

PS: As for static SAG, agreed it will be different.