Horn installation gone bad - What did I screw up?

[Seventh Son]

Not sure if this is the right place to post - Mods please move if necessary

 

Only I am capable of screwing up a simple plug and play horn replacement. 

 

I removed the OEM horn and plugged in a Denali Soundbomb Mini.  I switched the key on and pressed the horn button.  There was a slight delay and then it sounded like the horn was trying to make a sound but it didn't happen.  It just sounded kind of muted and then nothing.  So I turned the key off.  Unplugged the two leads, re-plugged them and then I got zero sound out of the Denail. Just to check things out, I then plugged the two leads into the OEM horn and now that doesn't work at all!!  I unplugged and reconnected the two leads multiple times and I have no sound at all from either horn.   What could I have possibly screwed up??

[AZJW]

@Seventh Son Are you trying the horn with it mounted or unmounted?   Often the ground is completed through the frame mount and if it isn't grounded to the frame, then no worky.  

 

Moved to Electrical 

[WalterT]

Another possibility is a blown fuse. I don't know the inner workings of the horn, but the initial current might just have started it up before the fuse went. Would result in the symptoms you describe. 

[Seventh Son]

4 minutes ago, AZJW said:

@Seventh Son Are you trying the horn with it mounted or unmounted?   Often the ground is completed through the frame mount and if it isn't grounded to the frame, then no worky.  

 

Moved to Electrical 

I believe on my last attempt I did mount it up and it still didn't work.  Maybe I blew a fuse?

[Seventh Son]

4 minutes ago, WalterT said:

Another possibility is a blown fuse. I don't know the inner workings of the horn, but the initial current might just have started it up before the fuse went. Would result in the symptoms you describe. 

Thanks Walter.  I thought that this could be a possibility, especially since the OEM horn wouldn't work either.  Do you know which fuse is for the horn?  

Edited September 10, 2021 by Seventh Son

[Seventh Son]

I just started checking the fuses and couldn't find any that were blown, but I noticed that when I turned the key to the on position and then started up the bike that I have no brake lights.  WTF??

[AZJW]

 

Looks to be fuse #9 on the wiring schematic which is the Signaling System Fuse.  Open the forward fuse box and check the 7.5A fuse. Guessing that'll be the culprit.

 

 

[AZJW]

20 minutes ago, Seventh Son said:

I just started checking the fuses and couldn't find any that were blown, but I noticed that when I turned the key to the on position and then started up the bike that I have no brake lights.  WTF??

Checking fuses can be misleading if one only goes by appearance.  Best way is either using an ohm meter on the suspected bad fuse or replace with a known functional one. 

[Seventh Son]

26 minutes ago, AZJW said:

 

Looks to be fuse #9 on the wiring schematic which is the Signaling System Fuse.  Open the forward fuse box and check the 7.5A fuse. Guessing that'll be the culprit.

 

 

Yes, it was the 7.5A Signal fuse that was blown.  How did you know??

 

So, I replaced it with a new fuse, turned the ignition on (brake lights now working), pushed the horn button and the same thing happened as before - the Denali horn made some attempt to blow, but then the fuse blew again.  Hmmm....

[AZJW]

Dead short in the Denali horn is most likely the problem.  I'd be looking for a replacement horn. 

[Seventh Son]

8 minutes ago, AZJW said:

Dead short in the Denali horn is most likely the problem.  I'd be looking for a replacement horn. 

I think you're right again.  I just re-installed the OEM horn and it works just fine.

 

Of course the Denali horn I have was purchased back in May and is well past the return date.  It's been sitting on my workbench and I just got around to installing it.  I'm going to call Denali directly on Monday and see if they'll replace the horn for me.  Their products have a 5-year warranty. 

Hey thanks @AZJW I really appreciate your knowledge and help on this.  Glad it didn't turn out to be something major. 

Edited September 10, 2021 by Seventh Son

[TeabagInsurance]

The horn should take 12V input. Rig it up to a 12V battery and see if it works (might want to wear ear plugs first). If it doesn't work, then your Denali horn is definitely borked and is shorting the circuit with no load, causing your fuse to blow.

[Seventh Son]

42 minutes ago, TeabagInsurance said:

The horn should take 12V input. Rig it up to a 12V battery and see if it works (might want to wear ear plugs first). If it doesn't work, then your Denali horn is definitely borked and is shorting the circuit with no load, causing your fuse to blow.

Makes sense to me.  Thanks, I'll give that a shot and report back.

[loneranger700]

Not to piggy back off this thread, but I just bought some $10 hella horns, so I'm gonna plug the low one in and start using that in lieu of the Denali one.

[Seventh Son]

1 hour ago, loneranger700 said:

Not to piggy back off this thread, but I just bought some $10 hella horns, so I'm gonna plug the low one in and start using that in lieu of the Denali one.

Which Hella horns did you buy?  Got a link?

[AZJW]

This is the one I installed,  but the mounting tab needed to be bent back a bit to keep it from rubbing on the radiator.  Good improvement over stock. 

 

HELLA 012588071 Black 92mm 12V Disc Horn

 

Sorry! Something went wrong!

 

[Seventh Son]

1 hour ago, AZJW said:

This is the one I installed,  but the mounting tab needed to be bent back a bit to keep it from rubbing on the radiator.  Good improvement over stock. 

 

HELLA 012588071 Black 92mm 12V Disc Horn

 

Sorry! Something went wrong!

 

Thanks.  If I don't get the Denali horn worked out I will try something like that.  I actually like the lower profile of the Hella disk horn rather than the big bulky Denali. 

[WalterT]

6 hours ago, Seventh Son said:

Yes, it was the 7.5A Signal fuse that was blown.  How did you know??

 

 

@AZJWwill have used the following logic 

- everything electrical is fused by design. 

- note: not every electronic item on the bike is fused individually, but in groups 

- look in the relevant page in the manual to see which item is protected by which fuse

- the service manual has more detailed info on which fuse protects what, the owners manual is simplified in this respect

In this case the signalling fuse, so that's the one to check

- visual check usually works but can be misleading (difficult to see sometimes). Better to measure with a voltmeter between ground(- pole on the battery or on the chassis) and the connections of the fuse)

 

 

Edited September 11, 2021 by WalterT

[Dougie]

Looking at the Denali website, the horn takes 5 amps, so without looking at the t7 manual, if it pushes that circuit draw above the 7.5 fuse then you’ve had it, it’ll blow each time. As long as the rest of the circuit is suitable, a larger fuse may be needed. I’d check for you now but I’m sat on the floor watching pol tarres videos. 
You could put a new circuit in with suitable cable on its own if you wanted. Then you could fit a Dixie air horn

check the amp draw on the original. 

[Seventh Son]

6 hours ago, WalterT said:

 

@AZJWwill have used the following logic 

- everything electrical is fused by design. 

- note: not every electronic item on the bike is fused individually, but in groups 

- look in the relevant page in the manual to see which item is protected by which fuse

- the service manual has more detailed info on which fuse protects what, the owners manual is simplified in this respect

In this case the signalling fuse, so that's the one to check

- visual check usually works but can be misleading (difficult to see sometimes). Better to measure with a voltmeter between ground(- pole on the battery or on the chassis) and the connections of the fuse)

 

 

Good stuff that's good to know.  Thanks Walt. 

 

I have very little knowledge about electrical things so my comfort level is low when working with stuff like this.  I really need to learn some basics and pick myself up a voltmeter. 

[Seventh Son]

So I spoke with a rep at Denali and they said if the circuit on which I'm trying to connect my horn can't support 5 amps then I need their wiring harness so I can connect the horn directly to the battery.  That, and I also need to purchase a relay.  That's a lot of crap just to install a horn, which I thought was supposed to be plug-and-play.

 

Has anyone else had to do this for the Soundbomb Mini?

[Dougie]

Did you try the horn on the 12v battery after? 
if it takes only 5A on the 7.5A signal circuit, it should be fine if nothing else is drawing current at the same time. So it’s possibly more than what they claim, or it’s faulty, or there’s something else running at the same time. I’ll dig my manual out. 

[Seventh Son]

2 hours ago, Dougie said:

Did you try the horn on the 12v battery after? 
if it takes only 5A on the 7.5A signal circuit, it should be fine if nothing else is drawing current at the same time. So it’s possibly more than what they claim, or it’s faulty, or there’s something else running at the same time. I’ll dig my manual out. 

I did not.  I'm looking to see if I have some other leads lying around that I can connect the Denali to. 

[Gekkdroid]

I always install the FIAMM Low Tone horn on all my bikes.  Low power draw, no relay needed, loud sound.  Comes with all mounting hardware.

 

Sounds great on my T7.

 

Sorry! Something went wrong!

 

[Seventh Son]

39 minutes ago, Gekkdroid said:

I always install the FIAMM Low Tone horn on all my bikes.  Low power draw, no relay needed, loud sound.  Comes with all mounting hardware.

 

Sounds great on my T7.

 

Sorry! Something went wrong!

 

Did you have to use the jumper wire that came with the FIAMM horn?