Rear brakes do not work!

[SKIPNOMAD]

I went to go for a short ride on the T7 after it had sat for too long and realized my back brakes do not work. The pads are fine as I have about 3700 miles on them. And I have taken the extra brake fluid out so that it a little below the full mark. Not sure why they would not work. Any help would be much appreciated.

[Bmp4510]

Depending on how you removed the fluid, perhaps some air snuck into the brake system. I’d try bleeding the brake and see what happens. Check also for leaks, and if you need to remover the caliper and gently apply some pressure to the pedal and see if the piston moves. 

[Ray Ride4life]

Do check the pads, the OEM seems to be made out of bread crumbs.

[Dougie]

Are they swirled with shite? If it’s been sat, give them a clean, make sure the pistons work and callipers are free etc, reassemble, check, bleed if necessary. 

[Landshark]

Considering that all else is good such as the pads, brake pedal travel obstruction etc.   First, try pumping the rear brake pedal to see if you can bring up the pressure.  If that doesn't work, do as others have mentioned and bleed the brakes.  I add a little to the reservoir at a time then push on the brake pedal to squeeze  out the little bit you put in.  Repeat as necessary.  If you need more details on how to perform this task, please ask.

[Hibobb]

@SKIPNOMAD It is tough to diagnose a problem without seeing the bike in person. The quote “A Problem Well Stated is Half Solved” is something that should always be remembered.

 

You got some good guys giving you a variety of good answers, but if you could help with a little more focused question. What do you mean by "Rear Brakes don't work"?

 

Are the pistons frozen and you have no brakes?

Is the brake pedal frozen in position?

Does the brake pedal feel mushy and travel all the way down?

Do you mean the brakes are dragging all the time?

Did you spay it down with WD40 before it "sat for a long time" getting oil on the rotor/pads?

Heck, some people feel the rear brakes don't work (a slight exaggeration) from the factory, as the stopping power was never much to begin with....

 

 

Edited April 10, 2022 by Hibobb

[Hibobb]

13 minutes ago, SKIPNOMAD said:

Sorry for the somewhat vague statement. When I press on the brake pedal there is no response from the brakes and it bottoms out. I will have to do some more investigation. I do not have much brake work experience. Would it be normal for the pistons to be frozen on such a new bike?

Skip,

 

No worries, we all are learning along the way....

First, NO it is not normal for the piston to be frozen, but it doesn't sound like that is your issue.

As you are thinking, bleed the brakes first. If this doesn't work, it may be a problem with your rear master cylinder. On a newer bike, none of this happens too often. The whole situation sounds odd.

 

Our T7's have anti lock brakes. I have never dealt with them before and they add another level things that can go wrong.

Edited April 10, 2022 by Hibobb

[SKIPNOMAD]

7 hours ago, Bmp4510 said:

Depending on how you removed the fluid, perhaps some air snuck into the brake system. I’d try bleeding the brake and see what happens. Check also for leaks, and if you need to remover the caliper and gently apply some pressure to the pedal and see if the piston moves. 

I took the extra fluid out of the reservoir after I realized the brakes were not working. I took the cap off and used a straw to remove the extra down to just below the full mark.

[SKIPNOMAD]

5 minutes ago, Hibobb said:

@SKIPNOMAD It is tough to diagnose a problem without seeing the bike in person. The quote “A Problem Well Stated is Half Solved” is something that should always be remembered.

 

You got some good guys giving you a variety of good answers, but if you could help with a little more focused question. What do you mean by "Rear Brakes don't work"?

 

Are the pistons frozen and you have no brakes?

Is the brake pedal frozen in position?

Does the brake pedal feel mushy and travel all the way down?

Do you mean the brakes are dragging all the time?

Heck, some people feel the rear brakes don't work (a slight exaggeration) from the factory, as the stopping power was never much to begin with....

 

 

Sorry for the somewhat vague statement. When I press on the brake pedal there is no response from the brakes and it bottoms out. I will have to do some more investigation. I do not have much brake work experience. Would it be normal for the pistons to be frozen on such a new bike?. Thanks for the input.

[SKIPNOMAD]

33 minutes ago, Landshark said:

Considering that all else is good such as the pads, brake pedal travel obstruction etc.   First, try pumping the rear brake pedal to see if you can bring up the pressure.  If that doesn't work, do as others have mentioned and bleed the brakes.  I add a little to the reservoir at a time then push on the brake pedal to squeeze  out the little bit you put in.  Repeat as necessary.  If you need more details on how to perform this task, please ask.

No, I have never bled brake before. My plan if I need to was to watch a video and read the Yamaha shop manual provided by  the great people of this site.

[NeilW]

1 hour ago, Hibobb said:

Skip,

 

No worries, we all are learning along the way....

First, NO it is not normal for the piston to be frozen, but it doesn't sound like that is your issue.

As you are thinking, bleed the brakes first. If this doesn't work, it may be a problem with your rear master cylinder. On a newer bike, none of this happens too often. The whole situation sounds odd.

 

Our T7's have anti lock brakes. I have never dealt with them before and they add another level things that can go wrong.

Rear brake pedal going all the way down with no braking. I had that happen to me on my first off road ride. Bike had about 3000 miles on it. I had been on gravel roads for several hours and in a down hill I pressed the rear brake pedal and NOTHING.  I pumped it and still nothing.  Used the front brake to stop and pulled over to check it out. Visual inspection at the side of the road didn’t turn up anything except the rear disc was burning hot. I am positive my boot position wasn’t riding the rear brake and my riding buddy behind me said my brake light wasn’t always on. We waiting a few minutes and rear brake came back. It happened one more time on that ride and then never again in the next 2500 miles. My rear disc is now a blue tint indicating it over heated. 

[Hibobb]

@NeilW You may have found cause & effect.

 

I have read where some guys unintentionally had their toe on the petal causing a slight drag and overheating.

Not saying this is what you did, but maybe Skip did.

 

Overheating boils the fluid and gets air into the system (increasing fluid height in reservoir). Sometimes the air goes away when it cools sometimes not. In anycase, Skip is bleeding his system which is the correct first step.

[NeilW]

13 minutes ago, Hibobb said:

@NeilW You may have found cause & effect.

 

I have read where some guys unintentionally had their toe on the petal causing a slight drag and overheating.

Not saying this is what you did, but maybe Skip did.

 

Overheating boils the fluid and gets air into the system (increasing fluid height in reservoir). Sometimes the air goes away when it cools sometimes not. In anycase, Skip is bleeding his system which is the correct first step.

 

13 minutes ago, Hibobb said:

@NeilW You may have found cause & effect.

 

I have read where some guys unintentionally had their toe on the petal causing a slight drag and overheating.

Not saying this is what you did, but maybe Skip did.

 

Overheating boils the fluid and gets air into the system (increasing fluid height in reservoir). Sometimes the air goes away when it cools sometimes not. In anycase, Skip is bleeding his system which is the correct first step.

It is possible I was riding the pedal as I was new to the bike. That is what I thought happened but I couldn’t confirm because every time I looked down and felt my right boot it didn’t seem to be riding the brake. But that is the most logical answer. Octam’s Razor. Never happened again after that ride. 

[Ray Ride4life]

My experience with the rear brake is when i turn the ABS off i sometimes need to pump the brake first to get it normal for the rest of the ride.
It's only the rear and i will look into it sometime but it's not the biggest issue so for me it can wait until the big service before my trip in July. Front is all fine so it's not like i end up with no brakes but it seems there is something not perfect with installation at the factory or at the dealers who get the bikes ready to deliver to the customers.

[Svrider]

I had mine sit for about 2 months without riding, and when I did ride it the pedal went all the way thru it's travel with about zero braking. The T7 doesn't have the best rear brakes even though they use Brembo calipers, my best answer/guess is that it is either the master has to small of a piston in it or it gets air in the system over time.  Get yourself a clear piece of hose that fits the bleed nipple on the caliper (4-5 mm id) long enough to provide about 6in of verticle travel and another 6in of down travel (About 12 in total)open the resivour, Crack the bleeder open and slowly activate the rear break to allow almost all the fluid in resivour to go empty. Refill the resi to full after tightening the bleed (not supertight) and the break preasure will come back up. The 6in of verticle hose will allow you to see any air bubbles come out of the system. Repeat if still a little mushy. This deffinately helps but mine still goes mushy after a few months so this might become ROUTINE MAINTANANCE. Should be anyway just more so on the T7.

Edited May 1, 2022 by Svrider
Spelling

[NeilW]

I got my 2021 OEM demo unit T7 with 1900 miles  on it. Put 1120 riding it home. The next weekend I rode to the mountains and after about 3 hours on gravel roads the rear brake pedal went al the way to the "floor". I stopped on a down hill to check it out and the rear disc was very hot. I was new to the bike, and standing the whole time, but I really don't think I was riding the pedal. I stand on the balls of my feet so my soles are horizontal to the ground. I waited a few minutes and then took off and for the next 2500 miles of on and off road it hasn't happened again. My rear disc got very hot as it is now a pretty blue tint.

just sharing.....

[Toppie]

The rear brake on my 2022 T7 is the biggest disappointment with the bike.

The system as a whole works OK.

That is;  the pedal puts the pads onto the disc and releases just fine.

So... lever and hydraulics in perfect harmony.

It just doesn't work very well at all.

I'll be trying different pads.

[Landshark]

4 hours ago, Toppie said:

The rear brake on my 2022 T7 is the biggest disappointment with the bike.

The system as a whole works OK.

That is;  the pedal puts the pads onto the disc and releases just fine.

So... lever and hydraulics in perfect harmony.

It just doesn't work very well at all.

I'll be trying different pads.

I'm going to replace the pads on mine as well, so I'll be watching what you buy for yours.  Mine work ok but I'd like better.

[Hibobb]

On 4/10/2022 at 9:34 AM, SKIPNOMAD said:

I have never bled brake before

Skip,

 

Did you ever resolve your brake issue? 

[SKIPNOMAD]

On 5/3/2022 at 8:26 AM, Hibobb said:

Skip,

 

Did you ever resolve your brake issue? 

Yes I did , thanks for asking

[TexasT700]

Tell us how, so we learn too!!

[jetdr21]

Mine has gotten air in the system now 3 times.  First 2 times I bled the system myself. Now at the dealer trying to resolve.  BTW They bled the system and let it sit, and guess what, it did it to them..  That makes 4 times...  So stand by for update when I get one..

[NeilW]

20 minutes ago, jetdr21 said:

Mine has gotten air in the system now 3 times.  First 2 times I bled the system myself. Now at the dealer trying to resolve.  BTW They bled the system and let it sit, and guess what, it did it to them..  That makes 4 times...  So stand by for update when I get one..

Interesting - my loss of rear brake only happens when it is hot, let it cool and it comes back. Happened 3x in 3000 miles and 10 months- ( please no suggestions on NOT riding the brake pedal- we are way past that)

[Eric W.]

On 5/3/2022 at 1:35 AM, Toppie said:

The rear brake on my 2022 T7 is the biggest disappointment with the bike.

The system as a whole works OK.

That is;  the pedal puts the pads onto the disc and releases just fine.

So... lever and hydraulics in perfect harmony.

It just doesn't work very well at all.

I'll be trying different pads.

Same here.  It's really the only complaint I have with the bike, but it is a complaint.

[NeilW]

52 minutes ago, Eric W. said:

Same here.  It's really the only complaint I have with the bike, but it is a complaint.

I installed Galfer front and rear and the rear was noticeably better than with stock pads.- very easy and quick swap out.

FD165G1396 HH  I paid 33.41 

[Eric W.]

8 minutes ago, NeilW said:

I installed Galfer front and rear and the rear was noticeably better than with stock pads.- very easy and quick swap out.

FD165G1396 HH  I paid 33.41 

Yea, I did the exact same thing.  The switch to Galfer got the front to a point where I was satisfied.  The Galfers improved the rear for sure but I'm still not happy.  Each time I start to complain I remind myself of the price point of the bike!  I test road a Tiger 900 rally just for grins earlier this year and was reminded what it was like to have brakes